So, then, the jīva at its origin, does he know which way to go? Is he in knowledge? Does he know to choose the superior energy? Does he have knowledge?

Devotee: How does the jīva know which one to choose? How does he know? How does he decide which one to choose, that he has to choose the superior? 

Śrī Śrīmad Gour Govinda Swami Mahārāja: Because the jīva belongs to the superior energy, not the inferior energy, if he chooses Kṛṣṇa or the superior energy, then he is in his constitutional position, and he will get pleasure. As Śrīmad Bhāgavatam says,


harir hi sākṣād bhagavān śarīriṇām
ātmā jhaṣāṇām iva toyam īpsitam
[S.b 5.18.13]


Jhaṣā means an aquatic animal. For example, a fish. A fish requires water. If he is in water, or watery circumstances, he is happy. He gets pleasure. If you take a fish out of the water and place it on land in a very comfortable arrangement or position, it will not be happy. He requires water because that is his natural atmosphere, his constitutional atmosphere. 

Similarly, the ātma, soul, living entity wants the atmosphere of Hari that is natural for him. If he gets that, he gets pleasure, as aquatic animals get pleasure in the water. Instead, if he is out of that atmosphere, here in māyā, the illusory environment, he cannot get pleasure. He needs that as an aquatic animal requires water. So, the soul, the living entity, needs that atmosphere, the environment of Hari. That's the natural atmosphere for the soul. This verse is there in the Śrīmad Bhāgavatam.

Devotee: So, then, the jīva at its origin, does he know which way to go? Is he in knowledge? Does he know to choose the superior energy? Does he have knowledge? Does he know Kṛṣṇa, and does he know māyā, or does he not know anything and just becomes?

Śrī Śrīmad Gour Govinda Swami Mahārāja: Yes, he knows everything, but sometimes he abuses his independence, so he becomes captured by māyā and comes down here because of abusing his independence. If you properly use your independence, you will accept Hari. You won't accept, or the jīva won't accept māyā. So, two choices are there: Hari and māyā or Kṛṣṇa and māyā, and the jīva, marginal in the middle, has to accept one. As jīva, you have independence, so you must exercise the proper use of your independence. If you abuse your independence, you will become attracted toward māyā; that's the abuse of independence. Yes, the jīva has knowledge because he is the eternal part of the Supreme knowledgable, Saccidānanda Kṛṣṇa, who is full of knowledge. But, the jīva has minute knowledge, not complete knowledge as Kṛṣṇa has. So, minute knowledge is sometimes dangerous because of a tendency for abuse. Therefore,  by not having complete knowledge, the jīva abuses his independence. However, naturally, he will get pleasure, "Oh, it will give me pleasure that Hari atmosphere."

Devotee: Seems amazing that the jīva having even a little knowledge, can still choose māyā even though he has some knowledge yet still chooses māyā instead of Kṛṣṇa.

Śrī Śrīmad Gour Govinda Swami Mahārāja: Yes, jīva has knowledge because jīva is a conscious being, and he is an eternal part of the Supreme knowledgeable. He has minute knowledge. Everything is in a minute form because he is a minute. Therefore, sometimes he abuses his independence and, as a result, is captured by māyā and is attracted to māyā. This is why he got attracted to the witch disguised as a beautiful maiden, although there were so many beautiful maidens in the palace. 

 

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